Karina (00:03)
You're listening to Thriving Dancers Podcast, a space for moms who believe that dance should build our kids up, not break them down. I'm Karina, your host, an integrative health educator, researcher, and dance mom. And I'm on the mission to bridge the gap between holistic wellness and the dance world. Because our dancers deserve more than rest and ice. They deserve full body, full heart support, so they can thrive for years to come.
Karina (00:37)
Welcome back to Thriving Dancers Podcast and I'm glad you're here today again. We're not going to have a very long episode. It's going to be a shorty and we are talking about this unpopular opinion that hit the ground running this past weekend. Except that it's not really an opinion. It's more of a fact that a lot of people just don't quite want to recognize yet, but it's okay. You everybody comes to this understanding, you know, either eventually or never or...
You know, they have to have some more facts before they really start to see things in a different perspective. And that is okay. You know, we all have our way of getting to the truth. And if it takes a person a little bit longer, it's okay. The situation that I'm talking about is where a teacher forcibly stretches a dancer. And that is something that has been shown in many studies that it really isn't okay to do.
Especially when you have a developing body of a young dancer that is not quite sure of where their limit is. And especially for a teacher who's also unaware because the dancer themselves are not aware where their body is at in terms of health. What I mean by that is some students may have undiagnosed conditions and the teacher would not know that.
Unless the student would tell them, and if it's undiagnosed, naturally it means the student also doesn't know it. And if that's the case, the teacher unknowingly may hurt a student. May not be something that's drastic right away, but it could be hurting that student over time and they would not know it until unfortunately it could be too late. So that is where this problem comes in.
Some stretching teachers believe that it is still okay to do that if you know your student well and if you really know their limits and a lot of other components that are part of that kind of a decision. However, in reality, there is no way for an external force to really know how far they need or they can push because only the person themselves knows and feels their body.
As you know, a lot of dancers, they want to please their teachers because they want to be bendy or they want to be more flexible. They want to look like, they can endure. But a lot of times they endure beyond the pain of just stretch and they get themselves in the situation unknowingly of having an injury that is irreparable sometimes. And that's how some of these dancers have broken backs. They have torn ligaments, torn muscles.
Not because the teacher wanted them to suffer. Of course not. That is never the case. We know teachers want the best for their students. However, they can't always know how far to push and what to do, no matter what they know about their students. Because everybody is different. now by that, I mean, every body, every human organism is different and not even just different from person to person, but from time to time.
Someday that same student who was so stretchy yesterday may not be so stretchy today because of something that took place earlier that day, or maybe some not very healthy dietary choices that has increased their inflammation. Whatever that is, the teacher cannot know that. And by those means, when you have a situation where a teacher is putting their own
force onto the student's body, they are unknowingly causing an issue. So, you know, when we're looking at this, there's also a way to look at it ⁓ from a perspective of risk versus benefit analysis, right? So if we're looking at it and saying, okay, I'm just going to stretch this student because I think they can go further. Well, why not?
give them the tools to be able to do that on their own, as opposed to having them push it. Because there are so many ways that gravity can do wonders a lot better than some external force.
This risk benefit ratio is very important because what is the point of having the student to be that stretched? Now, if they're going on stage and they're going to perform, well, they must have already have warmed up by themselves and they have to be able to have that ability to be stretchy up to a point where they need to be. Judges are not going to judge in ballet.
I'm not a judge, so don't take my word for it, but from what I have been observing and following a lot of judges is that nobody's going to say, ⁓ no, her foot is not far enough up, up in the air. They're not going to do that. They're going to look at so many other components that it has nothing to do of how bendy your dancer really is. And that difference between the break and the stretch can just literally mean
a millimeter of a push. And there's no way for a human, no matter how professional they are and how proficient and how experienced they are, there's no way for a person to really know how far they're going to push that is really going to push that body over the edge. And that's where that risk is through the roof, more exponentially, extensive.
compared to the benefit that is going to come out of this type of an activity. And that's where I, as a dance mom, am looking at this entire whole situation as now and future probability. And I'm looking at it as something that I'm not willing to risk my child's future ability to walk without pain, dance, and even just...
sit and do basic activities without pain for the possibility of them having their leg a little bit farther when they're dancing up on stage. It doesn't make sense to me in terms of the risk. And when we're looking at it from a dancer perspective, this is something that a dancer also needs to understand and have a limit to their body, that it's up to them to stretch it the way they feel their body can take.
not because someone is pushing on it. And the only way to know that is when a person is doing it on their own. Now, someone said it beautifully that, you you can also guide an athlete or a dancer that we're talking about in this case to stretch appropriately. That is absolutely an amazing opportunity for the teacher to guide and teach a dancer how to stretch properly, how to be that bendy, but without the
the risk of an injury from external forces. So this is very important. And I think that, you know, a lot of people just misunderstand the concept at this point. But once you really understand it from the scientific perspective and not just, well, it looks like, or well, they've done it many times before. Well, they know what they're doing. The reality is just like any good surgeon, there's still a risk.
for infection or for nicking something when they're doing a surgery. That's why you always have to sign the paperwork. And just because your studio signs that paperwork from you, you can prevent those kinds of things by just not doing them because ultimately it is absolutely unnecessary to do that step. And pushing a dancer's body is really never necessary. That if a dancer is not able to stretch like that on their own,
It's not because they're not, it's not because they don't want to or because they're lazy. It's because their body just may not stretch that way because of whatever anatomical differences that they may have. And I know that ballet is not very forgiving for the, you know, anatomical differences. Everybody has to bend and be a certain way. And if your body doesn't bend in a certain way, then a lot of times not very skilled teachers.
look at those kinds of dancers as someone who is just not able, they don't belong in ballet, which is kind of crazy. And of course we know that's not the case. And thankfully a lot of younger generation dance teachers are looking at every student with completely different eyes and different mindset, which is very refreshing to see. you know, consider also
a concept of parenting, right? So when we're looking at parenting, it used to be, and there are still some people who believe that spanking their kids is perfectly normal. I mean, that's the way that they were raised and, you know, tough love, really gets you there. But we know for a fact that that's not really good. It's not good for emotional, mental, physical, physiological, and God knows what many other cases.
In this situation, we still have parents who spank their kids and then we have conscious parenting. So there's a spectrum of these things and I just want dance moms, dance parents to look at this from a different perspective. And that is what I wish I had when my daughter was being stretched in this way. And I'd see the tears and the...
barely walking after that kind of experience from those classes. If I could understand at that time that that kind of activity is really truly not okay and by far not necessary, especially at such young age, I would have absolutely taken her out if the teachers were not willing to keep her in the class without doing the forceful stretching.
And, you know, I think that is something that we as parents just have to put our foot down and literally watch and protect our children's health as though their life depends on it. Because it does. Because that's the only currency that we have in life is our health. And if we don't have that, then nothing else matters. It doesn't matter that you've danced that role.
It doesn't matter that one time you got to do it. it doesn't matter that you got that first place at YAGP or wherever else you dance for that one time and then you broke your back because somebody pushed on it too hard. It's not worth it. So, you know, that's where, to me, a lifelong health is way more important than this micro moments that increase the risk of these kinds of injuries exponentially.
Because I want to see my child to be healthy and happy, not just in dance, but in life. And that's why I want to bring these issues up so that people can understand that it is up to us as parents to start speaking up about these things. Because no one else will. That when dancers speak up about it, oftentimes it's too late. When you see a lot of comments on social media on various posts that, yeah, this happened to me. yeah, my back got broken. mine too. here.
I can't walk without pain anymore. What do do about that? Well, really nothing at that point except for sympathize. But we as parents of current dancers who are experiencing the process of this potential injury, the process of this increased risk, that's when we can do something about it. And I think it's really about time that we start doing something about it. Because if we're going to be silent forever,
Our dancers are going to be either quitting dance, getting really injured or many other horrible things that I hear and read and talk to dancers about. And I just want this pattern to stop for any dancer. And dance is a beautiful art form and it needs to be beautiful inside and out. Dancers shouldn't put on a smile while they are dancing on a broken back.
because they want to be able to still continue doing it. They shouldn't have to do that. Their backs should not be broken. Their feet should function normally. They should be able to walk without pain. And when we have teachers who don't understand this concept, whose egos go first before their students' that's when it becomes a problem. And I know that a lot of these teachers, do not mean anything bad by it. This is what they've known.
And this is how they were trained. But you know, just because things were done before in a certain way does not mean that that is the right way. And we know that in many other ways, especially when it comes to kids and training.
So I trust that this information will find you in the right place at the right time so that you can look at it from a different perspective. You can do more research on it if you'd like, of course, and, you know, bring up information and bring up the studies. Although I will say that for every study that is pro, you'll always find against. For every study against, you'll find a pro because that's what scientific inquiry really is.
⁓ there's always, you, you have to be able to prove something wrong to be able to prove it right. However, to me, even the case study showing that if you push a little bit too hard, especially with a kid with a certain condition and when it's undiagnosed, you're going to increase the chance of injury by 50%. I'm done. I don't need to risk. I don't need to risk my child's wellness in that. And that's where I draw the line. So.
I encourage you to look more into it and if you have any comments or questions, please DM us at thriving dancers on Instagram. You can always reach out to us through the website, thrivingdancers.com and come visit us to the podcast to get more information on how to raise your dancer in a holistic way as a whole person so that they succeed not just in dance, but in life.
And that they continue dancing, whether professionally or just for fun and without pain, injuries and mental health issues.
I hope that you will return next week to listen to our next episode, which is, I'm going to say is going to be kind of a bombshell. Unfortunately, we have some news to share and we hope that you can be together with us as we go through this process. So we'll see you at our next podcast. Bye for now.
Karina (15:33)
Thanks for listening to Thriving Dancer's podcast. If today's episode gave you a new perspective, share it with another dance mom who wants better for her dancer. Remember, Thriving Dancers start with supported moms. I'll see you next time. Bye for now.
